My Community
Fishing Talk => Fishing Talk => : Eric H July 26, 2018, 11:57:56 AM
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https://www.ocregister.com/2018/07/24/watch-a-baby-great-white-shark-caught-then-released-at-dana-point-beach/
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That lady was annoying. Video could be used as fodder for the anti-fishing folk.
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Landing fish that we have been told not to land can be used as fodder for the anti-fishing folk.
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Everybody cool yer jets.
I have contacted the reporter and invited her to come meet us and learn what's really going on so we can get the truth out there.
I also explained to her that by doing these posts the way she does, she is actually causing more people to fish for them because guys see the pics, get excited, naturally want to catch one too, and she has provided them with location and time of day. We all know that means more guys that don't know what they're doing that are going to pose a threat to the fish, themselves, and swimmers.
She will be busy with the US Open of surfing for the next couple of weeks, but we'll touch base again after that and try to arrange a time for her to actually come out and discover what's really happening.
We need to educate everybody involved, not attack the uninformed.
8)
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Landing fish that we have been told not to land can be used as fodder for the anti-fishing folk.
Ben, you're out of line bro. The rules and regs say we must immediately release the fish once we identify it as a protected fish. You weren't there, I was, and you couldn't identify what it was until it was 10' away in the shore break.
Yes, at that point to comply with the letter of the law you should cut the line.
But, I have spoken with a number of DFW wardens in the field that all say privately that at that point they want you to remove the hardware if you can do it safely for the fish and the fisherman. To a man they have all said they want us to apply common sense and that they are not going to site anybody for landing and assisting the fish. They all also mentioned having a serious problem with pier fishermen that don't have licenses that hook into a large black sea bass or great white that are afraid to take the fish to the beach to release it because they are afraid if they step foot on the sand they will be cited for fishing without a license. Again, to a man all of the DFW wardens have said they would never do that and they wished fishermen would use some common sense.
If you do decide to land the fish to remove the hardware, do not stop to do anything but remove the hook and return it to the sea. No pictures. No measurements. Just land it safely as quickly as possible and return it immediately.
The agents in the field are the ones who are going to make the decision as to whether or not you are going to get a citation. And if they all tell me they would prefer me to handle a given situation a certain way, then I'm going to do everything within my abilities to meet their request.
This is a situation every land based big game fisherman should think about and decide for themselves what they are going to do before it happens so they know how to react should they face it.
8)
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It's also illegal to intentionally target them.
But sure, keep doing what you're doing - use massive hooks that aren't necessary for soupfins and sevengills, use baits much larger than is necessary for soupfins and sevengills, and kayak your baits out much farther than is necessary for soupfins and sevengills. And keep repeating over and over, "you can't help what ends up taking your bait". Do whatever helps you sleep guilt free at the end of the day. And by all means enjoy the publicity every time a beach-goer takes video of you guys "accidentally" catching your great whites.
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And for those of you who may have missed it, or not had it air in your area, the video was shown on the evening news. The coverage was pretty positive and mentioned the safe release of the shark. If you watch the second video, you'll see how happy the woman was when she saw it swim away like a champ 8)
We can't take an adversarial stance and attack people who are not as educated or experienced as we are. That will only lead to them becoming defensive and attacking us even more. We need to educate the public so that they know the truth and help fishermen new to the sport to conduct themselves properly, like true fishermen, so that we can continue to enjoy our favorite activity and protect our wonderful fishery.
Or, you know, you can go fish for catfish ;D
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Actually Chip, Ben is not out of line. He said "Landing fish that we have been told not to land can be used as fodder for the anti-fishing folk." Which is true.
Agents in the field telling you to use common sense is different from a situation that gets blown up in the media and social media where people higher in the agency and other agencies might get involved. As soon as something like this goes bigger than the local DFW Joe telling you to use common sense, Joe is gonna say he never told you that. We might know what's best to do to quickly and safely release a GW or BSB, but that's not going to stand up to the letter of the law if the anti-fishing group and government get involved.
Trying to say that you're only targeting Sevengills isn't going to last either. We all know that that area is not the best kind of environment to find them. And If I can land a 9 footer on my spinning gear, an 9/0 size reel is way overkill.
I'm not saying I wouldn't love to catch one, I would! But the bait, gear, and tactics you guys are using show what you're fishing for. There's simply nothing else out there that would require that.
I also don't think it would be such a big deal, if you guys weren't doing it on a highly populated beach, in the summer, during the day.
I purposefully seek out lonely stretches of beach and fish mostly at night in order to keep the public off my back.
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I'm really not trying to bash you at all Chip, I know you're a great guy. I know Bill is too, and Spencer sure seems great as well. I don't have anything against any of you, and love you all as fellow brother fisherman. ;D
I actually don't have an issue with targeting the GW's either, like I said, I'd love to catch one someday.
My concern is with how y'all are going about it and the negative repercussions that it could possibly reap. Not just for shark fishermen, but for fishing as a whole. My kids love fishing and are getting to the ages where they can do more of it without my constant assistance. I just want the opportunities to be around for them and their kids you know?
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Thanks for your opinions, here's what you can do with them.
(https://torqueanalytics.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/UsNoCAQ.jpg)
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Lol!i love that one!
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LOL, thanks Chip, I'll do that as soon as I have some alone time ;D
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I also don't think it would be such a big deal, if you guys weren't doing it on a highly populated beach, in the summer, during the day.
I purposefully seek out lonely stretches of beach and fish mostly at night in order to keep the public off my back.
I prefer to fish in the daylight on any beach I legally can, I didn't pay for a license to hide and sneak around at night. The crowds help pass the time, most are tourists that have lots of questions. I think stories like this are more positive on the sport than stories on guys that don't know what they are doing. If there are no positive stories, the negative ones will represent all licensed and unlicensed fishermen in the eyes of the public.
That beach is very deep right up to shore, kinda like the wedge in NP but not as extreme, there is not really any skinny there to see what is one your line until it is over the break and you run up to it, and jump back.
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I like the night time incognito fishing, no questions to answer and excuses to make up.
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I like the night time incognito fishing, no questions to answer and excuses to make up.
Exactly, plus I'm just not much of a people person. ;D
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Oh my. Lets everyone just calm down a bit.
If I may interject here...
The location this fish was caught is actually one of Orange County’s less populace, most productive beaches for ALL sharks. In fact, in the last month and a half that beach has produced 4 Soupfin, 1 Seven, a dozen leopard sharks, and 4 hook pulls on real large bottom fish, think big seven. And thats for me only. And all on the kayak baits. Until saturday there had not been a white shark hooked on that beach (to my knowledge) in over three months.....I for one had considered them gone for the year, and welcomed their departure as a way to ensure my big baits would stat in the zone offshore longer in hopes of exotics.
As to the talk of the baits being too large and the tackle too heavy: 1. I apologize, a 7’ Sevengill or 5’ soupfin or heaven forbid a “bait ray” or surf kitten unfortunatley has NO value to me as a sportsman. In fact a 7’ white is not exactly a big deal for me either. This fish was a pest and consumed a bait I had been saving for a real exotic, one of a odd-shaped build that what was hooked recently at the mouth of Dana Harbor! If I am going to fish, it is a big game affair at all times. I am always hoping for that one fish, be that a seven over 9’, a sixgill, a hammer (and yes, they are already here) or heaven forbid that grander mako I lost last summer 400 yards down the beach from the location in question! I apologize if that comes across as offensive, but I consider myself a big game angler, and anything a spinning rod (and i dont mean a superspinner/shorejigger) can handle conformtably is either too small or not aggro enough to arouse me. The big baits serve two purposes: 1. Longevity: The longer soaks in the zone reduce fatigue from kayaking and mean the crabs and lobsters can have at it for longer before its no longer appetizing. 2. Exclusion: Big baits keep the little fish off (usually). Dont really feel like kayaking 100 times a day for repeated bat rays and leopard sharks...unless I need bait....2. The drop distances we are fishing vary from 50-400+ yards. Its not about distance from the beach, its about presenting a bait larger than can be cast on lighter tackle. The hook size is a funtion of bait size. Yes, for soups and leopards our 16/0 hooks are large, but not inneffective, at all. But when you start applying an honest, scale measured amount of drag over 30lbs any less of a hook is going to pull, be that from a seven or a soup. We use the same size hooks for casted gear as for yak gear. You need more purchase with real drag ratings than a mini-hook can give you.
Its not like the only fish we catch is White Sharks, In fact, its not even what we catch most of the time! They just get a disproportionate amount of attention. Those sharks are there, theyre everywhere. They eat all baits, from 1oz to 30lbs. Trust me, reducing the gear will not reduce the hook-ups, only the amount of gear left in the fish. DFW have sat on my couch and asked that I get the gear back as much as possible when they are hooked. I feel bad that they continually get dragged into these stories as if there was some legal issue.
My personal opinion in this: More whites are hooked because there are more whites. I personally hook more whites because I’m on the water more. When we only casted we only lost more, not hooked less. And then they were swimming around with gear and that made negative press too! Damned if I do damned if I dont! I don’t hide because I have been assured that my
practices are solid and my methods within the statute. When asked to not fish somewhere by lifeguards I leave, when asked I explain. When asked by DFW to design a flotation device that would not remain affixed to the fish upon pier release, I did. When asked not to pose for photos we refrained from that practice.
I have been staying out of the fray on here alot once I got wind of some negativity surrounding my fishing style; a style very popular in other locales just emerging here in California. I did not wish to offend or start a fire here, you guys have a community and I appreciate that. I mistook the mindset here to be of a big game nature but I apologize for misreading the room.
Don’t go kayak baits if you dont want, dont daylight fish if you dont want, and dont fish heavy tackle if you dont want. But I intend to fish a way that is proven and effective and in search of that big landbased T, cali landbased hammer, landbased blue, or landbased mako (again!). And Ill enjoy catching some truely large bottomfish along the way.
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Hey guys, we've addressed this issue in the past more than a few times and each individual is responsible for their actions the minute they purchase a license. No need to re-hash it over and over or get mad at what other people want to say.
Please keep this thread civil or I'll lock it so it can fade with time. Lot's of good points made... and realize Chip has an anal thing going on through all his visual aides he has shown over the years.
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Chip has an anal thing going on through all his visual aides he has shown over the years.
Can't argue that Tom, there has been quite a extensive pattern ;D ;D
Sorry Chip, couldn't pass up the dig 8)
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Damn whites taking hammer baits. I'm always gone when they come in. I bet the ones around would give a better fight than that white too.
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Damn whites taking hammer baits. I'm always gone when they come in. I bet the ones around would give a better fight than that white too.
Oh Im sure they would! Some of the sightings are getting closer and closer! Any day...err...night now :)
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Damn whites taking hammer baits. I'm always gone when they come in. I bet the ones around would give a better fight than that white too.
Oh Im sure they would! Some of the sightings are getting closer and closer! Any day...err...night now :)
I've never seen a smooth hammer caught at night. Greaters sure, but smooth and scallops I've only seen during the day. Even when we'd go commercial tuna fishing they'd come around the boat during the day but nothing but threshers at night.